Aryan Invasion Theory proven false - Stephen Oppenheimer!

11-25-2005, 10:15 PM

http://www.bradshawfoundation.com/stephenoppenheimer/

Stephen Oppenheimer is a well renowned Genitict.
Here is a great review for his latest book "The Real Eve"

3 of 14 people found the following review helpful:
DNA evidence points to an Indian homeland of IE languages, November 17, 2004
Reviewer: Mayuresh Kelkar (Lynn, MA USA) - See all my reviews
(REAL NAME)
In a trail blazing work prominent geneticist Stephan Oppenheimer has
convincingly argued that all the non African peoples of the world have
descended from the first Out of Africa Eve mtDNA strain known as L3
and the first Out of Africa Y chromosome line labeled as M168.
Moreover, South Asia and in particular India has been a major location
of flowering for L3 and M168 as they spread through out the rest of
the world about 90,000 years before present. The story according to
Oppenheimer (2003) is as follows. The African people carrying L3 and
M168 left that continent across south Red sea across the southern part
of the Arabian peninsula towards Pakistan and India. On the maternal
side the mtDNA strain L3 split into two daughters which Oppenheimer
labels Nasreen and Manju. While Manju was definitely born in India
the birthplace of Nasreen is uncertain tentatively placed by
Oppenheimer in southern Iran or Baluchistan. Manju and Rohani (should
be Rohini), Nasreen's most prolific daughter both born in India are
the progenitors of all non African peoples.

The story on the paternal side is a lot more complex. M168 had three
sons, of which Seth was the most important one. Seth had five sons
named by Oppenheimer as Jahangir, H, I, G and Krishnna. Krishnna born
in India turned out to be the most prolific of Seth's sons. Krishnna
through his son Ho, grandson Ruslan through Polo, and great grandson
M17 through Ruslan, played a major role in the peopling of South
Asian, East Asia, Central Asia, Oceania and West Eurasia (see
Appendix 2, p. 374-375 of Oppenheimer 2003). Oppenheimer (2003) has
this to say about M17 and his father Ruslan:

"For me and for Toomas Kivisild, South Asia is logically the ultimate
origin of M17 and his ancestors; and sure enough we find highest rates
and greatest diversity of the M17 line in Pakistan, India, and eastern
Iran, and low rates in the Caucasus. M17 is not only more diverse in
South Asia than in Central Asia but diversity *characterizes* its
presence in isolated tribal groups in the south, thus undermining any
theory of M17 as a marker of a `male Aryan Invasion of India', (p.
152)."

"Study of the geographical distribution and the diversity of genetic
branches and stems again suggests that Ruslan, along with his son M17,
arose early in South Asia, somewhere near India, and subsequently
spread not only south-east to Australia but also north, directly to
Central Asia, before splitting east and west into Europe and East Asia
(p. 153)."

Reference:

Oppenheimer, Stphen (2003), "The Real Eve: Modern Man's Journey ouf of
Africa," New York: Carroll and Graf Publishers.

11-25-2005, 10:21 PM

I casually glanced the book in the local book store. He makes a point that all physiological changes in people are all environmental.

Coastal people in TamilNdu as they moved north became lighter in color and thier complexion changed.

That is why North Indins are of lighter complexion. As these same people moved further north into the frozen tundra they became white with blonde hair and blue eyes.

This is aground breaking work.

Maybe Hinduism is the mother of all religions.

12-07-2005, 07:07 AM

people change because of there soul not there environment. If i live in a stable i dont become a horse

jay74 · 12-07-2005, 09:11 AM

The physiological changes one goes through is different from karmic path because of your soul.

How is a person different when he has white skin with blue eyes compared to a person with Black skin and brown eyes.
As far the stephen's research goes there is none. As that person moves north his skin is exposed to lighter sun hence fairer skin.

This research will eliminate all the bigotary in this world. This will teach is to look at other Indians in a better manner.

12-07-2005, 09:28 PM

the Aryan Invasion theory was supported by many famous ppl like Max Muller (from germany). but recently archeologists have excavated many remains somewhere up in north west india (where Ganga is) and have found many ancient artifacts (like of Dance of Shiva) over 8000 years old. the aryans were supposed to have invaded after that..

so aryan invasion theory is wrong.

12-09-2005, 05:52 PM

do you have any links to any articles about these finds? do you know where it is? northwest India is not where the Ganga is, i believe.

they found nataraja statue from 8000 years ago? any evidence would be helpful, thanks you

jay74 · 12-09-2005, 06:19 PM

Underworld : The Mysterious Origins of Civilization (Paperback)
by Graham Hancock "Five kilometres off the south-east coast of India, submerged at a depth of 23 metres beneath the murky, shark-infested Waters of the Bay of Bengal,..." (more)
SIPs: inundation science, antediluvian landmass, inundation maps, yuga system, five antediluvian cities (more)
CAPs: Rig Veda, Indian Ocean, Glenn Milne, Anton Mifsud, Kumari Kandam (more)

This is a very good book on ancient India and archealogical findings.

12-10-2005, 11:46 AM

Is it scientifically credible?

A lot of the Aryan Invasion critcs write books on these matters but they are not scientifically credible, unfortunately.

Maybe there was an invasion, maybe there wasn't. I hope there wasn't, but most historians and archaeologists haven't given up the invasion/migration theory to this day, so I think it might actually be true. There's nothing solid to disprove this, and there is genetic evidence to support a more European bloodline in upper caste people than lower caste people. Which is not necessarily saying that there was an invasion or cultural domination, though. It could have easily been said IMHO, that whenever Europeans or people of European bloodline came into India, they just gravitated towards mingling with upper caste people rather than lower castes because that's where the power lay.

12-10-2005, 01:48 PM

As far as I know (I try to keep track), there has not been any major archeological find in India till date, which can challenge the present time line of Indian history. Rather, whatever evidence is being uncovered seems to be inline with the present version of history.

As an aside, a new theory has been developed in some academic circles which states the Indus valley civilization did not have a literary script. As this theory is new and also radical, it's credibility is yet to be established.

Cheers

jay74 · 12-10-2005, 08:37 PM

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
s far as I know (I try to keep track), there has not been any major archeological find in India till date, which can challenge the present time line of Indian history. Rather, whatever evidence is being uncovered seems to be inline with the present version of history.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

How about some evidence?

I have provided incredible authentic evidence that AIT is non-sense. If you really want an invasion then it is in the opposite direction. It is the Dravidan Migration Theory.

Any truthful sane man will go to the Stehen Oppenheimer's site or buy his book to find the truth out. People with agenda's will come up with excuses.

Human beings can lie but genes dont lie.

jay74 · 12-10-2005, 08:45 PM

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
there is genetic evidence to support a more European bloodline in upper caste people than lower caste people. Which is not necessarily saying that there was an invasion or cultural domination, though
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

One more liar. Did you read his research? When the research points to the fact that entire non-african population of humanbeings came out of India there are people again talking interms of Upper castes and lower castes.

Human history is 150,000 years old. Humans in India date as old as 90,000 years. Religion, castes, language are pretty much recent 4000 years. What happened for 86000 years will not die because of 4000 years of history you bigots.

12-11-2005, 12:58 AM

if the indus valley had no script, then what does the theory propose the indus valley seals are? money? or ID markers?

12-11-2005, 01:43 PM

What's new in this book? Nothing. Some Indians
seem to be the only ones paying attention to
two-bit wigger "scholars" who ain't worth
s h i t and are best ignored.

12-12-2005, 09:04 AM

http://www.christianforums.com/f76-n...-religion.html

Interesting forum, many Hindus already present there.