Prabuphada & ISKON - Page 2

02-24-2005, 02:03 PM

In chapter 6 verses 25 and 26 goes something like this

"His mind having been established in the self , he should not think of anything"

"Whenever the unsteady mind moving to and fro,wanders away he shld restrain it and control it in the self"

My question would be when krishna says take refugee in me, he points to himself. in the above stanzas he says about self . if he is talking about him he could have said "His mind having established in Me " instead he is using the world self .

Pankaja_Dasa · 02-24-2005, 02:32 PM

Self means the person.

Not the body,

THIS is spiritual knowledge not material. {body]

02-24-2005, 10:38 PM

Govindaram

The word "atman" in the slokas is translated to SELF here. It surely does not mean the person. It is the supreme consciousness that pervades everything.

Pankaja_Dasa · 02-25-2005, 09:13 AM

Krishna says in Gita-

Never was there a time when I did not exist, nor you, nor all these kings; nor in the future shall any of us cease to be.Bg 2.12

If Krishna is not competent enough to say as He is speaking to Arjuna as Guru then Gita makes no sense. Krishna or Guru speaks spiritual knowledge. So Krishna here is obviously speaking of the individuality of all those present on the battlefield. Otherwise there is no use in even having this verse in Gita. If you take one verse out then you miss a part. Chapter 2 is one of the most important. And everybody agrees this verse clearly defines Krishna as seperate entity to everybody else. So this means there is individuality also in the spiritual sence. As per Gita. As It Is.

Do NOT forget Guru speaks only spiritual. If not then that Guru is useless. Haribol!

02-25-2005, 10:01 AM

if that is the case , then we have the question of is god bound by time, name and form. Gita was not there before krishna as born. So what happens to all those mortals who were living before that period. The vedas say "tatvamasi", "aham brahmasmin" only and they dont point to any external god.

Its like christians saying "Jesus is the only god and you can get salvation only thru him", what happens to those people who were there before his time"

02-25-2005, 11:22 AM

Haribol,

1) God is not bound by time, name and form.

2) Krishna was never born. The knowledge expressed in the Gita was there before Krishna appeared on earth. As Krishna himself expounds, the knowledge was expressed by Krishna himself millions of years ago to the sun-god Vivasvan. Therefore the knowledge that Krishna is God was there and is there eternally.

3) aham brahmasmin is indicative of the fact that we are qualitatively one with God. We are constituted of the same elements i.e. sat, cit and ananda.

4) Before Krishna's time, there were worshippers of Krishna. Krishna is mentioned in the Upanishads, which are the most ancient Vedic scriptures. Sama Veda describes Krishna as the divine son of Devaki. In Ramayana, Vishwamitra performs yajnas in which he utters words such as 'Om Namo Devaki Vasudevayah' so there is plenty of evidence showing that Krishna as God is an eternal fact. It was known even before Krishna's advent 5000 years ago.

Hare Krishna,
Your Servant.