HH Dalai Lama

08-18-1999, 04:11 PM

In a message dated 08/18/1999 5:06:27 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
max_harris@... writes:

<< Are we entering a phase in human
history when the overly 'religious' aspects of spiritual paths
will fade away, leaving a post-religious spirituality and a
less mediated access to self-realization?

-- Max >>

"Less medicated," I interpret that you mean "the opiate of the people?"

That is an interesting set of questions there. We just had a conversation
out to dinner that Pope John Paul XXIII (the "Good" Pope) had drawn together
the Second Ecumenical Council so as to "reunite" the schisms of the Catholic
Church. Because it is said in "Revelations" that there will be a
unification, and the RC instantly overlaid this to "The Church."

But, a broader, more Aquarian perspective here at the birthing (which let's
remember is not easy, please) of the Aquarian Age, is that it may be more a
unification of the underlying principles of all different religious
perspectives and thier similarities instead of their differences. Something
on the order of Caroline Myss, Ph.D., as she wrote out the alignment of the 7
major Chakras, with the 7 Sacraments, with the Qabalah and their coherence
and integration in "Anatomy of the Spirit."

L*L*L
RainboLily

08-18-1999, 04:44 PM

Dear Rainbo & Max:

I think Max wrote and meant mediated:

<< Are we entering a phase in human
history when the overly 'religious' aspects of spiritual paths
will fade away, leaving a post-religious spirituality and a
less mediated access to self-realization?

Not medicated. This is like the game of "telephone" where one person thinks
up a short phrase or statement whispers it to the next person and so on until
it has gone around the room (maybe a dozen players) and the last person then
says aloud what the message was "supposed to be." By then it has ceased
resembling the original to such a degree that it becomes quite
hilarious...but it does show how easily the oral or verbal traditions and
even the written word can be altered by retelling.

)

Perhaps Max really meant "Mentholated" as in a soothing balm of religious
activity, but not quite the "Opiate of the Masses."

By less "mediated" I assume Max meant that religious activities would not be
directed, conducted or controlled by Religious Leaders, Popes, Dalai Lamas,
Gerry Falwells, or other starry eyed self proclaimed religious muckity-mucks.
(I apologize to HH Dalai Lama for including him in this group, as guilt by
association could be construed...and I do not intend this at all, but simply
include the Dalai Lama because that was the subject that got this discussion
rolling along).

I would like to think so...but people tend to have such a need for devotional
service and hero worship that I fear it will not be so easy as all that. We
still use the term Master in a devotional and respectful manner, and of
course in terms of Bhakti and due regard it is essential to spiritual
development, but should not be confused with blind devotion or following
without question. That path leads to trouble at the least and disaster in
most cases.

Blessings
Love,

Zenbob

08-18-1999, 05:23 PM

In a message dated 08/18/1999 11:45:13 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
ZEN2WRK@... writes:

<<
By less "mediated" I assume Max meant that religious activities would not be
directed, conducted or controlled by Religious Leaders, Popes, Dalai Lamas,
>>
Laughing, yes, obviously there is a sleepy Rainbow here, she had better go
find her pot of gold. THanks Bob.

L*L*L
Rainbo

08-18-1999, 08:37 PM

>From: RainboLily@...
>
>In a message dated 08/18/1999 5:06:27 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
>max_harris@... writes:
>
>
<< Are we entering a phase in human > history when the overly 'religious'
aspects of spiritual paths
> will fade away, leaving a post-religious spirituality and a
> less mediated access to self-realization?
>
> -- Max >>
>
>"Less medicated," I interpret that you mean "the opiate of the people?"

I trust you're joking, but you omitted the "

" sign, right?

By "less mediated access to self-realization" I mean what is
already the case for many who practice yoga or zen or other
meditational practices in a setting which is free from much
religious overlay (ritual & doctrine, mainly). There is
less need for external activities and belief systems to
support spiritual growth. I see this as a trend that will
continue, and popes and lamas may become anachronistic.

>That is an interesting set of questions there. We just had a conversation
>out to dinner that Pope John Paul XXIII (the "Good" Pope) had drawn together
>the Second Ecumenical Council so as to "reunite" the schisms of the Catholic
>Church.

Actually it was just Pope John XXIII. There have been only two
Pope 'John Paul's.

>But, a broader, more Aquarian perspective here at the birthing (which let's
>remember is not easy, please) of the Aquarian Age, is that it may be more a
>unification of the underlying principles of all different religious
>perspectives and thier similarities instead of their differences. Something
>on the order of Caroline Myss, Ph.D., as she wrote out the alignment of the 7
>major Chakras, with the 7 Sacraments, with the Qabalah and their coherence
>and integration in "Anatomy of the Spirit."

I recall having read something by Caroline Myss, but I don't
think it was the work you refer to. If she was using a deep
hermeneutic to uncover 'deep structures' common to the symbol
systems of different traditions, then this is compatible to
what I am suggesting, and is similar to what Jung and Aurobindo
did, each in his own way. There is wisdom in ancient expressions,
but there is also need for critique and revision. Humanity, and
not just individuals, is on a spiritual journey, and I expect
that we will grow and evolve new forms of expression and new
modes of being. Whether religion is overcome or transformed,
I don't expect it to remain the same.

-- Max

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